01-04-2013, 01:18 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-04-2013, 05:39 PM by ZeronosVega.)
Well, when concerns such as this come up, I feel it is best to do a meta-game analysis. For this particular case, we will look at two arrays; the first being magic damage at the minimum, average and maximum of a spell. The spells used with change as the level increases in order to signify character progression. The second arrays will look at the hit points of the mage and the knight classes, seeing as they have the potential for the lowest and highest HP based on static numbers. For this example, we will not include ability score modifiers nor class-granted abilities, as those are entirely variable and will just make this more complicated.
[code] Table: Magic Damage to HP Comparison
Level Spell Damage HP(Mage) HP(Knight) % of Total HP (Using Avg Dmg)
1 Fire: 2/4/7 10 30 40% | 13%
5 Fire II: 13/19/28 14/18/26 34/54/78 67% | 55%/35%/24%*
10 Fire Snake: 15/45/90 19/28/46 39/84/138 97% | 100%/54%/33%
15 Burn II: 15/60/120 24/38/66 44/114/198 91% | 100%/53%/30%
20 Ultima: 20/120/240 29/48/86 49/144/258 100% | 100%/83%/47%
[/code]
* From 5th level onward, the average damage of the listed spells removes 100% of a mage's minimum and average hit points. As such, it won't be listed.
Do note that this does not take into account the existence of meta-magic, which can ensure maximums or allow for greater dice pools. Also, many of these spells begin to carry secondary effects (i.e. the Burning status effect) which can cause a number of adverse side effects to a target. It is also worth mentioning that spells can be resisted or have their damage reduced due to barriers, armor or evasive actions (i.e. reflex saves).
As we can see, the damage does a sizable chunk no matter the progression. And considering the fact that the Knight has a horrible reflex save, we can assume that a majority of these attacks are going to hit for their rolled maximum rather than being halved. One of the key things to remember is that the mage typically won't be alone during combat. By having other players support the mage, you can see how certain threats could be easily removed with a little help. This is merely my opinion and if you feel that I have missed something, then please let me know. A system can only improve when there is positive criticism and discussion.
EDIT: We can also compare using monsters from the creature compendium at CR equal to the level of the caster. Instead of listing a specific monster per CR, I took the average HP (minimum, listed average and maximum) of all the creatures from the specified CR, as it gives a full range of data to compare with. Like in the table above, I used the average damage of the spells.
[code] Table: Magic Damage to HP Comparison
CR Avg. HP per CR % of Total HP
1 4/13/21 100%/31%/19%
5 35/69/98 54%/28%/19%
10 48/108/156 94%/42%/29%
15 240/375/510* 25%/16%/12%
22 330/555/780** 36%/22%/15%
[/code]
* Only the Phoenix Spawn was used here.
** World Weapons were the closest to CR 20.
Note: If there is an error in my calculations, do let me know so that I may correct it.
[code] Table: Magic Damage to HP Comparison
Level Spell Damage HP(Mage) HP(Knight) % of Total HP (Using Avg Dmg)
1 Fire: 2/4/7 10 30 40% | 13%
5 Fire II: 13/19/28 14/18/26 34/54/78 67% | 55%/35%/24%*
10 Fire Snake: 15/45/90 19/28/46 39/84/138 97% | 100%/54%/33%
15 Burn II: 15/60/120 24/38/66 44/114/198 91% | 100%/53%/30%
20 Ultima: 20/120/240 29/48/86 49/144/258 100% | 100%/83%/47%
[/code]
* From 5th level onward, the average damage of the listed spells removes 100% of a mage's minimum and average hit points. As such, it won't be listed.
Do note that this does not take into account the existence of meta-magic, which can ensure maximums or allow for greater dice pools. Also, many of these spells begin to carry secondary effects (i.e. the Burning status effect) which can cause a number of adverse side effects to a target. It is also worth mentioning that spells can be resisted or have their damage reduced due to barriers, armor or evasive actions (i.e. reflex saves).
As we can see, the damage does a sizable chunk no matter the progression. And considering the fact that the Knight has a horrible reflex save, we can assume that a majority of these attacks are going to hit for their rolled maximum rather than being halved. One of the key things to remember is that the mage typically won't be alone during combat. By having other players support the mage, you can see how certain threats could be easily removed with a little help. This is merely my opinion and if you feel that I have missed something, then please let me know. A system can only improve when there is positive criticism and discussion.
EDIT: We can also compare using monsters from the creature compendium at CR equal to the level of the caster. Instead of listing a specific monster per CR, I took the average HP (minimum, listed average and maximum) of all the creatures from the specified CR, as it gives a full range of data to compare with. Like in the table above, I used the average damage of the spells.
[code] Table: Magic Damage to HP Comparison
CR Avg. HP per CR % of Total HP
1 4/13/21 100%/31%/19%
5 35/69/98 54%/28%/19%
10 48/108/156 94%/42%/29%
15 240/375/510* 25%/16%/12%
22 330/555/780** 36%/22%/15%
[/code]
* Only the Phoenix Spawn was used here.
** World Weapons were the closest to CR 20.
Note: If there is an error in my calculations, do let me know so that I may correct it.