10-10-2014, 12:02 AM
Mach 10 was supposed to be something similar to a Chemist's Bombs, and the Warlock(3.5)'s Eldritch Blast. A spammable ranged touch attack that deals progressive damage, but by no means a game-ender.
60ft is the range of Eldritch Blast, and fits the 'siege engine' feel for the class. Black Mage spells also come with minor debilitation effects such as Weighted, or catching on fire, Mach 10 eventually gets something like this in the form of knockback and potentially falling prone, but only against creatures up to a certain size category.
1d12 and 2d6 are 'equal' but I would never use a Greataxe over a Greatsword. It's just the way my head works, I prefer average damage over a more common maximum. If Moogle wishes to shift to such a damage die that's his own prerogative, but I don't think that would be a balancing point. If anything 1d12 LOOKS a lot more powerful than 2d6. It isn't really, but the mind perceives it in such a way at first glance.
7d12 + cha mod is actually more than what we originally had.... as it is now Mach 10 caps out at 10d6(average 35) + Cha mod, what you're suggesting ends up with 7d12(average of 45.5) + Cha mod, almost 10 more average damage per blast. And 25 ft + 5ft/3 levels would end up with 55ft range, though I think you might have meant 5ft/level to get 120.
I'll admit the idea of channeling sonic energy through a melee weapon felt a little out of place, but perhaps that could be worked into a talent rather than a Class feature everyone gets.
The Metamagic feats were meant to be ways for the Sonamancer to burn through resources to boost their sonic abilities, but again I could see something like the 'Empower' Arcana that Red Mages(Magus) get in ffd20/PF. 6 and 12 were just eluding us to fill, and lots of other classes got bonus feats and such... this was just a slower progression. Fighter/Combat feats don't really fit for me, since a lot of feats that benefit ranged weapons (Such as Deadly Aim) don't work with ranged touch attacks. Still, I think we can do a bit better than just tacking on some metamagic feats... that much is true.
Explosive Reposition was meant to be a sort of 'counter attack' feature. Still- I like what you're bringing to the table... Mach 10 already has knockback and potentially falling prone. At 8th level when a creature provokes an AoO from the Sonamancer they can instead spend a Sona Point to deal 1d4 + Cha mod damage and shift 5ft as an immediate action. At 16th level she can do this whenever missed by a melee attack as well, but each time consumes an AoO(meaning you'd need Combat Reflexes to use it more than once).
Weapon Proficiencies: Hadn't thought on those yet. If we're removing Sound Strike as a built-in feature and making it more of a Talent to choose, then I'd say just simple weapons works fine. This isn't a warrior class, it's closer to the Warlock... some dude who tries to pretend he's a wizard with some neat stuff but is ultimately a one-trick pony.
On that note: Armor Proficiencies, Light armor, no shields. Certain features should only function when in light or no armor such as Sound Armor and any of the movement based ones.
We did already have a talent planned that let their sonic damage bypass some hardness, and deal full damage to objects since Paizo decided to make all energy damage(sonic included) simply do half damage to objects before applying hardness. Boring.
Criticals: Not sure whrere you heard that spell-like abilities only maximize, but if it involves an attack roll it can critical- and if no range is specified it's a 20/X2. So Mach 10 deals double damage on a critical, and for Sound Strike(whether kept as a feature or made into a talent) the Mach 10 damage WOULD be doubled (only doubled regardless of the multiplier on the weapon) just as with a Magus or Red Mage's Spellstrike.
Doing Sonic Strike at a range doesn't make a lot of sense unless it's a thrown weapon...
Feinting wouldn't do so much for this class. It's built for range, if you're getting ganged up on in melee the best course of action is to disengage- such as with a 5ft step, and retreat while the other melee characters beat up on your threat. This doesn't hold true for all Sonamancers, such as those who focus more on channeling sonic in melee or close range(Point Blank Shot), but it'd be for the 'standard' ones.
d10 HD wouldn't work. In PF all d6 classes have poor BAB, all d8 classes have average BAB, all d10 and d12 classes have full BAB. Only exceptions being a couple rare prestige classes. The Sonamancer does run off of attack rolls, but it;'s main source of damage is a Ranged Touch Attack, so average BAB was all it needed. Siege Engines are not traditionally that hardy, it's why they need range- if a catapault or trebuchet or ballistae had one gear, one rope, one joint messed with it'd ruin the whole device. Modern-day tanks are slightly more hardy but even they have very big weak points like getting stuff stuck in the treads.
The class is strong in areas and lacking in others, as it should be. Making it d10 HD and upping Mach 10's damage would be taking it a little over the top... but you've had a lot of good insights and opinions and an outside opinion is necessary to get this in working order.
60ft is the range of Eldritch Blast, and fits the 'siege engine' feel for the class. Black Mage spells also come with minor debilitation effects such as Weighted, or catching on fire, Mach 10 eventually gets something like this in the form of knockback and potentially falling prone, but only against creatures up to a certain size category.
1d12 and 2d6 are 'equal' but I would never use a Greataxe over a Greatsword. It's just the way my head works, I prefer average damage over a more common maximum. If Moogle wishes to shift to such a damage die that's his own prerogative, but I don't think that would be a balancing point. If anything 1d12 LOOKS a lot more powerful than 2d6. It isn't really, but the mind perceives it in such a way at first glance.
7d12 + cha mod is actually more than what we originally had.... as it is now Mach 10 caps out at 10d6(average 35) + Cha mod, what you're suggesting ends up with 7d12(average of 45.5) + Cha mod, almost 10 more average damage per blast. And 25 ft + 5ft/3 levels would end up with 55ft range, though I think you might have meant 5ft/level to get 120.
I'll admit the idea of channeling sonic energy through a melee weapon felt a little out of place, but perhaps that could be worked into a talent rather than a Class feature everyone gets.
The Metamagic feats were meant to be ways for the Sonamancer to burn through resources to boost their sonic abilities, but again I could see something like the 'Empower' Arcana that Red Mages(Magus) get in ffd20/PF. 6 and 12 were just eluding us to fill, and lots of other classes got bonus feats and such... this was just a slower progression. Fighter/Combat feats don't really fit for me, since a lot of feats that benefit ranged weapons (Such as Deadly Aim) don't work with ranged touch attacks. Still, I think we can do a bit better than just tacking on some metamagic feats... that much is true.
Explosive Reposition was meant to be a sort of 'counter attack' feature. Still- I like what you're bringing to the table... Mach 10 already has knockback and potentially falling prone. At 8th level when a creature provokes an AoO from the Sonamancer they can instead spend a Sona Point to deal 1d4 + Cha mod damage and shift 5ft as an immediate action. At 16th level she can do this whenever missed by a melee attack as well, but each time consumes an AoO(meaning you'd need Combat Reflexes to use it more than once).
Weapon Proficiencies: Hadn't thought on those yet. If we're removing Sound Strike as a built-in feature and making it more of a Talent to choose, then I'd say just simple weapons works fine. This isn't a warrior class, it's closer to the Warlock... some dude who tries to pretend he's a wizard with some neat stuff but is ultimately a one-trick pony.
On that note: Armor Proficiencies, Light armor, no shields. Certain features should only function when in light or no armor such as Sound Armor and any of the movement based ones.
We did already have a talent planned that let their sonic damage bypass some hardness, and deal full damage to objects since Paizo decided to make all energy damage(sonic included) simply do half damage to objects before applying hardness. Boring.
Criticals: Not sure whrere you heard that spell-like abilities only maximize, but if it involves an attack roll it can critical- and if no range is specified it's a 20/X2. So Mach 10 deals double damage on a critical, and for Sound Strike(whether kept as a feature or made into a talent) the Mach 10 damage WOULD be doubled (only doubled regardless of the multiplier on the weapon) just as with a Magus or Red Mage's Spellstrike.
Doing Sonic Strike at a range doesn't make a lot of sense unless it's a thrown weapon...
Feinting wouldn't do so much for this class. It's built for range, if you're getting ganged up on in melee the best course of action is to disengage- such as with a 5ft step, and retreat while the other melee characters beat up on your threat. This doesn't hold true for all Sonamancers, such as those who focus more on channeling sonic in melee or close range(Point Blank Shot), but it'd be for the 'standard' ones.
d10 HD wouldn't work. In PF all d6 classes have poor BAB, all d8 classes have average BAB, all d10 and d12 classes have full BAB. Only exceptions being a couple rare prestige classes. The Sonamancer does run off of attack rolls, but it;'s main source of damage is a Ranged Touch Attack, so average BAB was all it needed. Siege Engines are not traditionally that hardy, it's why they need range- if a catapault or trebuchet or ballistae had one gear, one rope, one joint messed with it'd ruin the whole device. Modern-day tanks are slightly more hardy but even they have very big weak points like getting stuff stuck in the treads.
The class is strong in areas and lacking in others, as it should be. Making it d10 HD and upping Mach 10's damage would be taking it a little over the top... but you've had a lot of good insights and opinions and an outside opinion is necessary to get this in working order.